relationships are hard

[anonguy]

I'm in my mid twenties and my gf is in her early twenties. She's still in school. We've been together almost a year.

The last few days were horrible and we've been arguing over little things. I tried to talk peacefully and she was willing and we were talking. A tv show that she watches weekly unfortunately broke the time we were utilizing to talk things out. She had to watch it, even with me pleading that our conversation was important. Her perspective is to let her watch her show and then she'll get back to the conversation.

I'm trying to justify her actions by telling myself she's young and immature. I find it difficult to believe that such a little sacrifice is so difficult. Is my justification sane?

[coach]

I think you may be right about her lack of maturity - she seems to have shown little empathy with where you were at, and how you were feeling, and given in to her soap-a'holic tendencies.

Could be a dash of 'power-play' in there too - the: 'am I bothered' move that leaves you feeling de-prioritised

I would suggest you don't read too much into her juvenile action over this, but if she is generally not prepared to take you seriously, then maybe she's just too young (immature) for a serious relationship.

[hugglepup]

Darn right relationships are hard and even the so-called experts have their moments.

I don't think that a relationship can be classified in terms such as 'black and white', 'right or wrong'. Tough relationships are valuable in their own way. Every experience teaches us something IF we're willing to learn. Instead of assigning blame or pointing a judgmental finger at your girlfriend for her immaturity, try to see it in a more constructive way. She IS young but given the opportunity and your patience she will mature and grow with you (hopefully closer together). Why do we always expect people to conform with our own ideals and get angry when they don't?

Here is what I suggest:

--Find a moment when you're both calm and tell her how you felt about this situation. Don't make 'You' statements e.g. 'You never listen to me' or 'You prefer to watch television rather than work on our relationship' These are accusatory and will immediately get her into a defensive state (that is quite normal). Instead make a lot of 'I' statements which reflect your feelings and will be less likely to make her feel defensive. e.g. "I value our relationship and I want it to work. We both know that we have certain problems and we need to work them out. I felt hurt that you wanted to watch the soap opera, rather than continue with the discussion but perhaps we should have set aside a particular time (or...made more time) for that discussion. Would you like to do that now?"

-- Make a date to have a long discussion. Make sure that you set enough time for it. A discussion can go on for two or three hours. I personally think that you can deal with most if not all your issues within an hour or less if you conduct the discussion in a certain way. (See Discussion Suggestions below)

-- I always think about a sandwich when I say this. A bit of unpleasantness is always more palatable if it is sandwiched within two slices of something good. You love one another and that is what you should start and end with. Tell her you love her and hold her before you start your talk. Do the same at the end. Don't ever say "I love you BUT....' 'But' statements negate all you've said before. Remember that.

DISCUSSION SUGGESTIONS:

-- Set aside a good block of time. Allow for an hour but make sure that neither of you have to rush off for any reason afterwards (e.g. favorite soap, appointment etc.)

-- Have your discussion in a quiet, peaceful place where you are unlikely to be interrupted.

--When you set the date and time for the discussion, both of you should spend time apart thinking about your relationship. I suggest that you write down the issues that need to be looked at during the discussion. Make points and ask her to do the same.

--This might sound silly but it works. Relationship counselors have used this technique with great success. Use a spoon or any other suitable object. Decide which of you will talk first and that person gets to hold the spoon. The other agrees not to interrupt or interject while that person is holding the spoon. If you're talking, you'll be holding the spoon and even if she disagrees with what you're saying, she should not interrupt. She can, however, make notes on her paper. When you're done, you hand her the spoon and she is allowed the same opportunity. Arguments normally escalate because one or both partners are not willing to listen to the other's point of view. Both of you should agree to actively listen while the other talks. Listening involves paying attention without allowing emotions to get the better of you. If one person hogs the time and doesn't want to hand over the spoon (which sometimes happens if you have one more verbose partner), a time limit could be set and a timer kept. All of these rules might seem to take the spontaneity out of a discussion but if you really want to resolve issues, they are handy techniques. You can decide at a certain point to discard the spoon and allow free discussion but only once you've both had the opportunity to express your points of view.

--The aim of a discussion is to resolve conflict. If for example a couple live together and one is doing all the housework and feels resentful of the other because he or she is a slob. Instead of saying 'You're a slob' he or she could say "I'd like you to help me with the housework. What would you be willing to do on a daily basis? How about......?" etc. Once agreement has been reached, write down what you've decided so that it can't be forgotten. So many people baulk at this part but it will avoid the 'You said....' kind of statements that crop up during future arguments. If you write down what was decided upon, type it up, keep a copy and give one to her, there can be no argument. In a future discussion, you could say 'Let's look at our old list and see how well we've done at keeping our commitments.' Once again, avoid accusatory comments and understand that relationships are a process, and there are no instant fixes.

I could tell you a lot more about how to handle a discussion but I've written enough already. There are plenty of good books on the subject. If you're really interested in working on this relationship. then find a good book and agree to read it together and apply what you learn. E.g. Men are from Mars and women are from Venus.

I wish you all the best with this. Drop this whole soap opera thing. It's really not a big deal in the grand scheme of things. The most valuable lesson in life is to allow your loved ones their humanity and to stop harping on at them about their faults or failings. You can't change what's happened but you can do something about how you handle things in future.

Let us know how your discussion worked out. I'd be interested to know if anything I've shared has been of value.

Hugglepup

[anonguy]

Thank you for your responses! The feedback is great. I feel her actions at the time were inappropriate for a serious relationship. I will try to drop that though, because, well, its the past now and there are more important things to work on. :)

I've been reading online about conflict resolution and I've tried to lose the "you" statements (although its very difficult when getting frustrated).

In the past week while we were arguing, I had attempted conversations with phrases such as "I'm feeling.. " which is realistically a "I'm feeling .. because you .." but I leave out the second half. The response I've gotten to that (and this may be due to mood at the moment) is "Well there's nothing I can do about it" .. I end up hitting a wall and feel more frustrated. We end up not discussing the subject and then hardly talking for a few days. If I take an active approach and suggest actions that would aleviate the negative feelings, I am accused of being demanding and get actively yelled at (I dont think there is any excuse for yelling, but that is another argument in itself).

She is busy with school and the amount of work is stressing her out. During busy times, I ask that efforts be made to atleast make the few conversations we have pleasant. A few kind words go a long way when communication is limited.

Earlier today, the first communication for the day: I am at work and she came online between classes from a lab. I sent her a hug emoticon on msn and got something in the form of: im busy, talk later.. I understand she was busy and I didn't want to take too much of her time. I asked for a hug in return and I'd leave her alone to get back to her work. I got a "nope" in response.. It upset me and I haven't been able to get it out of my mind. I complained to her at the time and me complaining only frustrated her (obviously, because she already stated she was busy -- I didn't realy think straight there). Perhaps I'm being over sensitive now. Perhaps I should have just said ok and not asked for anything. Honestly, the fact that I did ask and was denied, is very disheartening -- I would never deny her affection if she asked. In this situation, the little act of kindness would have gone a long way. By tomorrow, I'll be over this too, as once again, its the past. But today, it affects me.

[coach]

Hey come on!...

... all this assertion theory is good stuff - I have written and run courses on self-assertion - but to have a relationship that is viable, it does take two!

Maybe she is playing games, perhaps she really doesn't understand what a mature relationship is about, or maybe she is just not that committed, but you need to expect some input from her - the meaning of a relationship is that of two way effort and commitment.

I think you really are trying to 'be' the relationship - you can't do that, stand back now and expect some effort from her.

Good luck - you may have to face up to the fact that she is just not as committed as you are.

[anonguy]

How do I stand back?

I've tried giving less attention in the past. But it was usually when my feelings were hurt (or in form of revenge, when I'm trying to prove a point). She did notice and sometimes made effort to try to talk to me. However, her temper sparks when I try to explain what was bothering me (perhaps I make too many 'you' statements and get her on the defensive).

It's hard for me to give someone I love less than 110% Today, I feel bad for doing that in the past. I think its nothing but a form of conditional love, which is not how things should be in an ideal relationship.

[coach]

I think that maybe the more effort you make, the less likely she is to respond in a positive way.

You sound as if you want to get as close as you can to her, but she seems to need some space.

Only she can explain why that is, but then is she going to make the effort to explain?

Maybe her stress over her studies is causing her to become self-contained - stress takes some people that way.

You say it's hard for you not to give 110 percent, but if you do all the giving then you may receive less than your fair share - I can appreciate that you don't want to "count the cost", but it does take two to make a relationship work.

Perhaps you can pick a time when she is feeling relaxed and have a discussion about what she wants and where she sees the relationship going.

Seeing if your respective expectations are anything like similar may help you to get some idea of where you stand.

Good luck!

[XxCrazygirl22xX]

Of course your 100% right. I like older men myself i would never act like that. Relationships are way more important then a stupid TV show. Some people handle things differently. Maybe she felt she needed time to think about what she was going to say, You sound like a real sweety. Tell her to grow up or hit the curb :)

[hugglepup]

Hey again anonguy,

I just read your second post to this thread. I'm sorry to say that I really think that your girlfriend is taking you for granted. Here is what I'd suggest. You seem extremely good at expressing your feelings in writing. Why not write her a letter where you can express your feelings openly?

Try to be balanced and accept your share of the responsibility. Try to stick to 'I' statements again but be clear in the letter that you would like her to make more effort on your relationship. I was shocked when I read about how she spurned you after you asked for a hug. Typing 'nope' took as long if not longer than sending the required emoticon. Then again she might have perceived your request as being selfish after she'd told you that she was busy. Either way, her response was immature and selfish. Having said this, I don't believe that lovers should ever have to 'ask' for love. The kind of insecure statements that all of us have made at some time or another e.g. 'Do you really love me?' 'Please kiss me' etc. Love should be spontaneous and demonstration of it should not have to be requested. The exception to this is when you have the serious talk. It is then ok to say 'I want to know if you love me and are as committed to this relationship as I am.' etc. In the letter you can openly share your needs and it is OK to have them!!! Just as you should make it your business to know what her needs are and to do your best to fulfil them. (Remember if one of her needs is 'space' you need to respect that too. Some people need more space than others)

If this fails to bring changes, I would seriously think about moving on. As 'coach' said in a previous message, you seem to BE the relationship and in my opinion you are doing all the work. It's time she showed you how important this relationship is to her.

Good luck!
Hugglepup

[Howard]

I'm in my mid twenties and my gf is in her early twenties. She's still in school. We've been together almost a year.

The last few days were horrible and we've been arguing over little things. I tried to talk peacefully and she was willing and we were talking. A tv show that she watches weekly unfortunately broke the time we were utilizing to talk things out. She had to watch it, even with me pleading that our conversation was important. Her perspective is to let her watch her show and then she'll get back to the conversation.

I'm trying to justify her actions by telling myself she's young and immature. I find it difficult to believe that such a little sacrifice is so difficult. Is my justification sane?


Was she distracted by your conversation Anon? :confused:

[Rich]

Obviously her views on relationships and what's more important aren't the same as yours. She's still immature and I wouldn't marry this girl for another few years yet.

It's not a relationship ender at this point, but hopefully she'll come to understand what's more important.

If these types of actions from her continue, then obviously she doesn't feel as committed to you and the relationship as you do. You then make your decision to stay or go at that point.

[Howard]

What's been happening lately Anon?

[anonguy]

I have positive stuff to say as an update! :D

Her temper is easy to ignite and once ignited, well, things only go downhill from there. So, I've continued to work very hard at dropping all the 'you' statements or anything that would provoke her. Furthermore, we've discussed the yelling and she's agreed to try to watch herself. The moment I feel she's on the defensive, I back off and try to get her to calm down. I also know I can be a little too insecure at times so I've started maintaining a diary and try to deal with the 'little' things on my own.

So what have been the result of those changes? Well, our arguments have probably gone down by an order of a magnitude. I've seen her consciously and actively make sacrifices, very common in the beginning of the relationship but not as common in recent months. I started the diary writing negatives. But recently, I've had entries which had negative/positive blends and more importantly, entries which were entirely positive. As usually something significant has to happen to motivate me to write in the diary, I think we're making strong strides forward.

Relationships are hard. Not impossible, just hard!

[Howard]

I have positive stuff to say as an update! :D

Her temper is easy to ignite and once ignited, well, things only go downhill from there. So, I've continued to work very hard at dropping all the 'you' statements or anything that would provoke her. Furthermore, we've discussed the yelling and she's agreed to try to watch herself. The moment I feel she's on the defensive, I back off and try to get her to calm down. I also know I can be a little too insecure at times so I've started maintaining a diary and try to deal with the 'little' things on my own.

So what have been the result of those changes? Well, our arguments have probably gone down by an order of a magnitude. I've seen her consciously and actively make sacrifices, very common in the beginning of the relationship but not as common in recent months. I started the diary writing negatives. But recently, I've had entries which had negative/positive blends and more importantly, entries which were entirely positive. As usually something significant has to happen to motivate me to write in the diary, I think we're making strong strides forward.

Relationships are hard. Not impossible, just hard!


Does this mean you're back together with this girl?

[Rich]

In relationships it's not about the symptoms, but the root cause. If your partner has a temper and your way of dealing with it is to just not piss her off, that's not much of a solution. You won't be able to keep up that part of the solution over the long haul.;

She needs to learn maturity and self control. No need for anger in a relationship.